Words by David C. Obenour
For what is likely to be the last studio album released from Lee “Scratch” Perry – as even five years after his death our plane of existence struggles to catch up – there is a want to find closure from Spatial, No Problem. But what could closure look like for an artist like him? One of the most important figures in Jamaican music – in music – he was a producer, performer, singer, musician, and label owner. Whatever the moment called for – he was that. No single release from his catalog can be anything other than a look into the man in the moment. What he found interesting, funny, compelling.
Arriving in Berlin at the time he was meant to arrive, he connected with musicians, studio spaces, instruments, cool stickers, and electronic pioneers, Mouse on Mars. The album pulled from these sessions blends deep global influences and improvisation grounded in a mutual respect… and maybe a slight, sly distrust of the “voodoo” haunting the German’s machines. It could have only have been made by those players at that point in time – which sounds obvious and mundane. At least until you hit play.
Off Shelf: Can you talk about how the opportunity to record with Lee first started to come together? Is there a moment it first felt most real and exciting?
Jan St. Werner: We didn’t really think that this would really happen and were slightly ambiguous about the project. Kind of like: interesting if it happens, no problem if it doesn’t. When Lee eventually really showed up it was a trip!
The kickoff was an accidental noise from a custom built synth in Patch Point‘s workshop in Berlin, Kreuzberg. We checked out some gear the very evening Lee arrived. The shop had just opened a new space right across from our studio and we joined the opening party. Lee was curious and strolled around. He was also keen on collecting weird stickers. When I tried to get sound out of one very obscure synth it produced a deafening feedback. We all looked at Lee wondering how he would respond and expected him to dislike the loud noise. Instead he was laughing so hard that it kind of set the tone for the whole project: nothing to worry, everything was part of the session, no limits, no expectations, no rules.
OS: Bridging cultures and generations – to say nothing of your collective rich musical experience – how did you prepare for working together?
JSW: It wasn’t quite easy to prepare because we had never met each other and had no idea how Lee wanted to work or which process would suit him. Andi [Toma] had made drum sessions with Andrea Belfi and there were a few harmonic and melodic sketches that could run in loops so we could jam along. Other than that, we had set up microphones everywhere and invited friends to help us record in various rooms in the studio. We were also using recording rooms of other studios on the same floor, so we borrowed space for a couple of days to explore different set ups and experiment with all possible kids of equipment. There were instruments everywhere: drums, percussion, bass, keyboards, electronic tools. We had set up as many microphones as we could get, as well as a mobile recording units, some zoom devices, and other little things we had or borrowed from friends.
Our friend Darrin [Wiener] from Patch Point brought electronic gear, custom-built instruments and various other pieces of equipment, so it was like being in a giant toy shop — a Willy Wonka’s music planet! We were curious about everything and wanted to try everything. There was a harp in the kitchen and Lee had plenty of other gadgets in his suitcase: stickers, toys, and things that he had picked up somewhere along the way.
So we had this kind of universe of different sounds and instruments, and we didn’t really discuss anything. Things came together pretty quickly. The whole process felt very natural, fluid, and the production was a steady like parallel streams of sounds and jams in paralle spaces.
OS: In no way diminishing your own catalog and accolades, did you feel at all intimidated going into this collaboration? Maybe if not intimidated, were there things you worried might not connect in your working together?
JSW: No, not really. At first we thought we would do an album for Lee but it quickly turned out to be a collaboration. Also due to the fact that a bunch of musicians had joined. In the end we had so much material that we had to make sense of it all in retrospect. The editing and production process was yet another adventure. Especially when Lee died, we really had the obligation, the responsibility was all on us. We did our best to understand the nature of the project and slowly realized what Lee had left us. With the help of Dodo [NKishi] and Louis [Chude-Sokei] we slowly deciphered the lyrics and the many entanglements. It was a riddle and a ride.
OS: In relation to making music, I feel like “play” is often read as “perform” – which loses some of its beauty. Can you think of ways that this collaboration felt like you were playing with Lee?
JSW: [laughs] Yes, and Lee was playing with us! Playing can also mean tricking or pulling someone’s leg and this collab definitely has many connotations of which some we are still deciphering. The project is not only about making music, it is also about listening and coexisting, letting things happen or making space for things to happen. We tried to step back and take away some of the intensity we usually put into our own work. The presence of so many other musicians also helped to take a step back.
OS: Rhythm is such an unrelenting and central focus throughout this music. Can you talk about how you approached finding and shaping it particular to this project?
JSW: There are many idiosyncratic rhythms on this album. The rhythms of Andrea Belfi’s drums, of Regis’ [Molina] saxophone licks, Andi’s guitars, my synthetic processing, Dodo’s percussion and guitar, etc. It feels like ‘Spatial, No Problem.’ is also about space in which things can co-exist and overlap, happen at the same time or run out of sync but be still connected. It’s more like a call and response type of rhythm although there’s motorics, too. It’s a bit like a street carnival where it’s all rhythm and yet those who walk first in the parade have a completely different sense of what the beat is about than the folks walking in the rear.
OS: How do you think this album turned out differently than you may have imagined at first? What surprised you about the choices he made and how did you respond?
JSW: We were surprised how colorful this turned out to be and how letting go and not wanting to control can get you closer to the core of things. The nature of this album is openness, and that’s what Lee brought and what we’re good at – but sometimes forget because we’re always in charge for every detail, every sound, and the overall mix. This record reminded us in parts of ‘Dimensional People’ which also featured a lot of contributions by other musicians. This record, although it was a real production effort, also chased the producers out of our minds.
OS: How do you reflect now on his legacy? How does having spent this time with him affect that?
JSW: When we hear a Lee song now, whether it’s ‘The Upsetters’ or some dub track he made, we hear the humor and storytelling quality in them. We feel close to his voice since we spent so much time with every syllable and squeak and vowel. Now we feel pretty connected although we hardly got to know him. It really feels dada and voodoo at the same time.
How this album stands in his career? No idea. Maybe it’s a bit similar to Von Südenfed – some fans thought it was a great album and some didn’t like the transformation or escapism. Thought we had been a bad influence on Mark [E. Smith]. Both times Eleni Poulou had had a huge influence on how things were going. She gave us a good kick and confidence and without her both collaborations would not have come together.
OS: It’s a broad question but I’d be curious, how do you feel impacted as a musician and as a person from this project?
JSW: Just privileged to have been part of this and also surprised what life keeps coming up with. It never stops being interesting. It’s a bit like we can do whatever, keep the challenges coming.
OS: Can you talk about the live immersive event for the album that happened as part of Barbican’s Project A Black Planet exhibition? How do you feel this better or differently conveyed the music as opposed to a more conventional performance?
JSW: It’s a way to open up the perspective on what this album was and how music doesn’t have to be consumed in one way only. It’s a break of standards and formats. It could of course go much further with new musicians coming in and jamming along with the spatial audio mixes or sound being taken out of the room and expand to the exterior, too. A friendly explosion of all the elements that make this or any kind of music more organic. To think of music not just in linear time and in stereo but also as a 360 degree expansion. Like as if a dub or echo would expand into every direction and would yet sound different from whichever angle you listen.